Interview with Matt Thorson

Greg Livingston (Golem): An Untitled Story is a sequence of jumping puzzles, much like your earlier games such as Jumper. However, it uses a giant continuous world rather than distinct stages, and it features a host of upgrades to collect. What advantages did these adventure elements afford you as a developer? That is to say, why not just put everything in a sequence of stages instead of putting it all on one map?

Matt Thorson: I'm always tempted by the idea of building a huge world. I love the sensations of exploration and discovery for their own sake. I remember designing for aimlessness a lot - I wanted the player to wander without a specific goal in mind, and discover things to do. That's not something that is really possible in a linear game like Jumper.

Golem: Did these adventure elements introduce any challenges or downsides?

Matt Thorson: I definitely bit off more than I could chew when I started AUS. It was way too ambitious for my skill level. I improved a lot while making it, and ended up going back and remaking a lot of it at the end. It took years to finish, which is a huge project for me. So I guess the main challenge and downside was the sheer size of the game. But it had to be a huge game for the adventure elements to work, I think.

Golem: Early on, the player gains the ability to warp between save points. Because save points are placed in many convenient locations, this means backtracking does not cost the player much time. Did you view reduction of backtracking a key element to An Untitled Story, and if so, why?

Matt Thorson: I wasn't interested in forcing the player to backtrack through areas, but I still wanted them to. Backtracking in a Metroidvania can allow the player to reflect on the progress they've made since they last traversed that area, and seeing an old space in a new way because of new abilities can be fun, but it often just feels boring and forced. So I hid a lot of secrets in every area to reward the player for returning, then I let the player skip around the world so they'd be able to choose when and where they want to explore.

If you're trying to get 100%, there are a few places where you're forced to backtrack even with the save warping system, but these are probably my least favorite parts of the game.

Golem: The game is littered with minor upgrades, such as those for health and jump height. How did you decide how to pace these--how did you decide how many health upgrades to put in one area versus, say, how many jump upgrades?

Matt Thorson: With AUS I thought of upgrades mostly as rewards for completing challenges and tried to pace them accordingly. I think this worked well for the health upgrades, but for abilities the pacing should take into consideration the ramp-up of the character's abilities, and making sure each upgrade is significant.

If I were to make another Metroidvania, I'd probably try to use fewer ability upgrades but make each one more meaningful - having so many jump upgrades for example feels superfluous now. But part of AUS's flawed charm for me is in how much of it is superfluous.

Golem: Aside from jumping puzzles, some upgrades are hidden behind shifting block puzzles. How did you come up with this idea? Why add a block puzzle minigame to a game that's mostly about platforming?

Matt Thorson: A major goal with AUS was always for it to feel gigantic. One (lazy) way to achieve this is with mini-games because they provide variety. This is also in the vein of Rare's games from a time period that had inspired me (eg. Banjo-Kazooie).

Golem: Did you have a favorite ability from the game? If so, why that one?

Matt Thorson: The downward slam move is my favorite because it affects play in many ways: It lets you travel faster, gives you platforming options, changes combat, and opens gates. And it just feels fun to do.

Golem: This one's a little abstract. In terms of video games on the whole, which is more important to you: the intention of the developer, the experience of the player, or the essence of the game in and of itself?

Matt Thorson: All seem like valid approaches. But for my work, I would say the experience of the player. I try to put myself into all my games, but I want players to connect with them on their own terms rather than search for what it meant to me.